Super Jayhawk (super_jayhawk) wrote,
Super Jayhawk

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Misogynistic People I'm Sorry To Know

I just had to post a response to this in my LiveJournal tonight from someone I know who, well, I've known for quite some time, but didn't realize was quite the pro-war ignoramus that I thougth he was. His original comments are at, at 5:57pm on Tuesday March 18, 2003, on the eve of our nation's preaparations of an unjustifiable war.

Like most right-wing regimes, he does not allow any comments in his posts, so I'm posting a reponse in mine, as follows.

Subject : Jerry, get a clue.
Response to : eakinj's LJ Entry on Tuesday, March 18th, 2003 5:57 pm.

Jerry, I try not to read your LiveJournal because I find it disturbing.
I generally try not to even respond to your comments because while it's
hard to squick me out, I have to take exception to your Limbaugh-esque
commentary on Tuesday March 18, 5:57pm.

Since you don't seem to encourage discourse or differing opinion on most
of your posts, I'm responding to a previous entry, but this one is
intended for a previous LJ comment of yours. Of course, you don't
allow me to even post there, so I'm going to E-mail this to you and
then splatter it all over my LiveJournal with a vengeance.

I am willing to let many things slide, Jerry, but this is something that
deeply needs clarification in such dark times for our nation.

>I mean really, all he did was butcher how many millions of people?
>how man jews? How many people were >tortured, how many people where
>experimented on?
>I suppose we should have sat with our thumbs in our ass there too?

Actually, Jerry, we as a nation DID sit with our thumbs in our ass, from
1938 to 1941. We pretty much let the Nazis rape, maim, torture, and wipe
entire towns off of the map. It wasn't until Roosevelt (DEMOCRAT)
actually got us into World War II because he dared the Japanese
to bomb Pearl Harbor, which they did.

If you go read some history books, you will find that the Republicans at
the time argued against even screwing with Hitler, or trying to stop
him. Most of the reports of maim, torture, death camps and "ethnic
cleansing" were entirely disbelieved as being too outlandish, too
impossible to ever happen.If you take some time to research this you'll
find the world looked the other way for much of WW II.

>Pro-"peace" is generally pro-murder. Most of the people protesting are
>doing it against bush, not because of war.

Oh, so killing people is not murder, but trying not to kill people isn't
murder? In the words of George Orwell, Freedom is slavery. While Saddam
is an evil dictator that does really nasty things is definitely true, we
have about 50 countries that have that problem. Should we invade them

Even people that were willing to line up behind Bush after 9/11 are asking
questions, Jerry. Our own people, and people around the world are asking
whether it's right to perpretrate an unprovoked invasion against the will
of the majority of our own people.

>I find it amusing how people always say 'no blood for oil' yet they
>ignore the hundreds and hundreds of facts about crimes against his own
>people. They ignore the survivors who fled Iraq. The ignore the man who
>designed many of their torture devices including one that rains acid on
the captives.

Yes, and guess what, Jerry, we as the United States under Bush I
supplied the chemicals, the gas, the Weapons of Mass Desctruction (WMD)
that made all that possible. Donald Rumsefeld (our current evil
Secretary of Defense) delivered such things personally while on a mission
to Iraq in 1988. The Bush administration supplied billions of dollars for
"agricultural loans" to Iraq that they turned around and bought Scud
Missiles, VX Nerve Gas and yes, you guessed it, Weapons of Mass
Destruction. Because the whole Reagan/Bush policy was to try to destroy
Iran, we gave Saddam whatever he wanted.

If you stop and look at it, Jerry, we as a nation have done some pretty
terrible things in the name of propping up American interests and backing
brutal dictators in the name of fighting Communism, usually with evil
dictators that use rape, murder, torture and things that would make Hitler
proud. The list is a long one... Somoza, Marcos, Charles Taylor, Saddam,
Mobutu Sese Seko, Mussaraf, Botha, Pinochet, the list goes on. This is
because of the "Reagan Doctrine" we as a nation suffered from where we
basically said, if they're not Communist, we'll look the other way and
give them lots of cash to oppress their people.

Does this make it right? Absolutely not. But we need to fix our own
behavior before we think we can go out and beat other nations into
behaving correctly.

>It's funn how NONE of those people protested Clinton bombin iraq in 98.
>Oh but it's different because it's a republican. FUCK YOU.

Gee, Jerry, there's a BIG difference between bombing because they expelled
the UN inspectors (1998) and invading their whole country and killing
countless hundreds of thousands because you want their oil. America as a
nation is not in the business of invading countries to pillage their
natural resources, until we had Dictator Bush take over in a political
coup over two years ago. Also, please observe, there's a BIG difference
between doing things with UN approval (which Clinton did in 1998) and
doing things without permission from the entire world community (like
Generalissimo Bush is doing now).

>You chicken shit fucking idiots. Stop playing politics and actually LOOK
>at the facts. LISTEN to the people who are suffering.

>By saying we're doing something wrong in iraq right now, is EXACTLY like
>saying we should have done nothing in Europe when 6 million jews were
>slaughtered. It is EXACTLY like saying that the people who were living
>under oppression in Afganistan should STILL be suffering under the

Gee, Jerry, you bring up a good point there. Bush FORGOT to include any
funding for rebuilding Afghanistan after we trashed it in 2001 for this
year. This has Afghantaistan President Hamid Karzai out with his hat in
hand asking for funding before warlords, or worse yet, the Taliban (not
"talaban", Jerry... get a spell checker god damn it!) take the whole
country back over again. We did a shoddy job of rebuilding Afghanistan
after we "liberated it", what makes you think we'll do any better with
Iraq, once we piss off the entire Arabic world and have to deal with 7
different ethnic warring tribes? America as nation is not ready to deal
with that at all.

The funny thing about most ultraconservate right-wing sons-of-bitches is
that most of them didn't give a rat's ass about Saddam or any of the
things he was doing to his own people before our illegitimate so-called
President rolled out his new initiative to take out Saddam after Labor Day
weekend last year. Were YOU thinking about Iraq last summer? I bet
not. Here's a shocking relevation for you, Jerry, Saddam has been there
for over 20 years and Reagan and Bush both pretty much helped him get
where he was. The only reason that Bush now is pounding the War like he
is is because people like you, me, and Brad can't find jobs, and the
economy sucks. He knows that,and he's totally unable to deal with it, or
help in a way that Presidents are generally supposed to care. Rather than
give a crap about your situation, he's doing a big call to arms to take
the nation's mind off of the economic misery that we're currently mired

Hitler did this once, too, in 1938. A German foreign minister under
Gerhard Schroeder even said this, and was forced to resign from her post
for saying it, but it doesn't mean it's not true. Nations, and tribes
before them have often resorted to war to take their minds off of the
problems at home. Kind of like going and beating up someone weaker than
you when you feel inadequate about yourself.

>By saying we're doing something wrong in iraq right now, is EXACTLY like
>saying we should have done nothing in Europe when 6 million jews were
>slaughtered. It is EXACTLY like saying that the people who were living
>under oppression in Afganistan should STILL be suffering under the

The Taliban took over Afghanistan in the 80's, Jerry, and put in an iron
rule that oppressed their people. Did YOU give a crap about who the
Taliban, or even know who they were before 9/11? Did Bush?
Probably not, most of the world ignored Afghanistan before then, and so
especially did our country. Is it right, or even just, to slaughter
millions of innocent people just because their nation is the Target de
Jour? Bush sets a dangerous precendent here... 2001, we invade
Afghanistan... 2003, we invade Iraq.. who next? Do you think the
world community will sit aside while we invade and take over whoever we
want? Under George Fucking W Prick-Ass Bush, we're acting like a little
kid that picks fights with everyone on the playground, and that's not what
America does. We finish wars, we don't start them.

Remember, Jerry, when you hear the Bushies cry, "He's gassed his own
people for crying out loud!", that it was George Bush the First that gave
him the gas cannisters to do gas 100,000 Kurdish rebels.

>Perhaps if the Democrat who was in office for 8 years had used it balls
>for something then pushing sperm on an intern we wouldn't be facing this
>issue now.

Perhaps, Jerry, if George Bush the First hadn't called off his troops when
they were "9 miles from Bhagdad" and told them to retreat and stand down,
we wouldn't be in this situation either. Schwarzkopf and his boys were
ready to take Iraq and kick Saddam's ass, and Daddy Bush told them to stop
and stand down, and walk away. Remember that. Schwarzkopf was so pissed
that he protested, and when he was told to shut up, retired outright. You
don't see him speaking out in favor of this pseudo-war, do you?

There's far too much attention given to the whole Clinton-Lewinsky affair
as a justification for the evil Republicans to destroy the world, take
away our rights, commit fraud and corporate scandal, and destroy the
international structures (NATO, the UN, the G-7) that have provided a
delicate balance of power in the world for the last 55 years. Just
remember, it's better to fuck over one intern than our whole nation.

(And just so you know, Nancy Reagan had an affair in the White House
too... the White House is no stranger to extramarital sex).

>I am so fucking sick to death of fucking petty ass people bitching and
>moaning about what's going on, simple because it's not their president.
>Fuck you. you'd better wake up.
>The only shame we face is if we do nothing.

Admirable, Jerry. I don't see your ass signed up and out in the Saudi
sand with a rifle in your hand. The fact that we've pursued this war
uniterally without the consent of anyone in the UN, the Security Council,
or even the American people makes it fundamentally wrong.

You believe in it that much? Great. Go sign up, impress me. Just
remember, they'll cut all your hair (facial and cranial) off.

>Fucking people and there "Well lets try this" 12 years. 12 fucking
>years. Iraq is what? 400 miles across? Jesus that's smaller the
>California? And you're telling me it takes 12 years to
>disarm? Bullshit. absolutely bullshit.

Gee, Jerry, for 4 of those years a Bush was in office, and he didn't
bother following up on any sort of disarmanment at all after Gulf War
I. For the first year and a half that George W Shrub was in office, he
didn't even pay attention to Iraq at all. He dind't even roll out his
product line of War until September 2002. Why? Corporate scandals, the
economic collapse, and the evil things that Bush II has been doing are
starting to get noticed! Hey! Look over there! Orange alert! War! War!
Don't look at Bush and Cheney humping Enron and Halliburton execs in
the Lincoln Bedroom!

Does Iraq have (WMD)? Sure. So does Israel, Russia, Saudi Arabia, France,
England, China, N. Korea, and about 50 other nations on the globe. North
Korea even has NUKES! Bush has tried to ignore it, but they could launch
one if they wanted to. Don't you think it's a little odd, really, that
we're completely ignoring a country that actually has REAL nuclear
capability and trying to take down a country that only has imagined
nuclear capabilities?

Oh, wait! North Korea has no oil. Gee, you don't suppose that we'll
dodge a nation that has nukes, but no oil, to go after one that has no
nukes, but lots of oil, and is an easy target, by a Presidential
Administration that's owned by the Oil Industry? Nawww...

Be careful of being told what to think, and who to hate. George Orwell warned us
of this, over 50 years ago.

>What's next? Maybe we should stop hunting down killers. We should let the
>sniper from a few months ago lose and give him his gun and ammo back.
>Why not? It's about as smart and standing still on Iraq.

Reagan and Bush (I) stood still for 11 years on Iraq, Jerry. Does that
make it right? Not really. Does it make it right to piss off the entire
international community by going on a unilteral invasion of another
country without consent from most of the world? Not really.

There is dangerous precedent in a nation deciding it must invade another
nation without consent from the world community. Go look it up in the
history books, Germany invading Poland, the Soviets invading Afghanistan,
and the US invading the Phillippines in the early 20th Century. All three
of these events involved catastrophic destruction, the murder of thousands
of innocent people, and retaliation on a terrible scale, all in the name
of glory and cult-of-personality leaders. What makes you think this time
is any different?

"Liberation." "Invasion.". There's a big difference. Think about it.

>Now don't get me wrong. I hate *ALL* protesters. I hate anti-war pro war,
>anti arotion pro abortion. whatever. I hate protesters of all
>kinds. Sign toting assholes. All of them. Makes no difference what
>side or what cause.

BTW, it's "abortion" that I think you're trying to say here, not
"arotion". SPELLING!

Protesting, Jerry, is what makes America what it is. Do you think
there'd be a 40-hour work week (rather than a 96-hour work week) if
unions and protesters didn't rally and say that they weren't going to
take it any more? There was a time in 19th Century America that Irish
were told, "Irish Need not Apply" for jobs becuase of their race. Do you
think that the employers suddenly decided to be nice and hire them
later? Hell, no. Protests brought it to the forefront and made
oppressive people make deals.

If you were in the same situation, Jerry, where you had to fight to defend
what's yours, for example your way of life, your job or your home being
taken away, you bet your ass you'd be right out there with a picket
sign. Before your systematic disdain for protests of any kind, put
yourself in those people's shoes for a minute and try to understand their
point of view before you hate. Hate, like war, should be a last resort,
not the first option.

>I'm looking forward to the end of this war. I look forward at laughing at
>all the material they find with a french logo on it. Especially the
>chemical compounds.

There will be less material with a French Logo on it than the Ameican Flag
on goods that we sold Iraq from 1981-1991 that we not only sold them, we
financed with some pretty good interest rates. Nerve gas agents,
missiles, the same WMDs that we now accuse Saddam of possessing (well, we
kept the receipts at least). You know why we want to invade first,
before the international community can participate?

So we can hide the evidence. That's important for George W. Shrub as he
tries to get his sorry ass reelected. After all, it looks bad if BushCo
has their logo on the same weapons that he's speaking out so feverishly

I've let you bitch and carp for a long time, Jerry, and I haven'y said a
thing, even if I fundamentally disagreed with it. I've generally
been able to let such things roll of my back. But this Limbaugh-esque
commnentary you offer tonight is over the top, and I think you need to at
least consider a few things...

- Did you give a crap about Iraq before Bush told you to in
September 2002? Think hard, it wasn't that long ago.
- If it was your ass sitting out there in Saudi Arabia in a tent,
would you be that eager to go rushing in and kill thousands of
innocemnt people in the name of Texaco, when they're not going to
give you anything for it?

If you got sick from Deleted Uranium weapons or our own chemical
agents, and got "Gulf War Syndrome", would you be OK that you
did it in the name of the oil industry, even if you were sick
for life like so many Gulf War Veterans now?

- Do you think Bush's war with Iraq will actually help you get a
job, in any way? Presidents are supposed to give at least half
a rat's ass about the economic well-being of their citizenry,
and he isn't doing that at all.

- How many people is it OK to kill just to get their oil?
A thousand? A million?

- If we attack other nations just because we want to, or want their
stuff, without permission from the rest of the world, how does that
make us any better than Saddam, who did that to Kuwait in 1989?
(Or Germany in 1939, the Soviets in 1980, or Japan in 1941).
Don't you think that encourages other nations to misbehave the
same way and take over other countries whenever they want to?

- Do you really think Bush would be trying to do this if the economy
wasn't in the toilet? Then why didn't wait nearly two years before
doing anything about Iraq at all? By that token, he should have
done it the day after he was inagurated in January 2001.
Think about all those oppressed people he turned a blind eye to
during that whole time.

- Do you think the Bushes REALLY give a rat's ass about the
Iraqi people, much less the American people? If that was the case,
wouldn't Daddy Bush have tried to "liberate" Iraq right after he
gassed his own people in 1988? That was 15 years ago, and we've had
six years of Bush opportunities to do something about it then.

Think about it. No, really, think about it. And then decide for
yourself, not what Karl Rove or Ari Fleischer tell you to think. The
truth will set you free.

But only if you want it to, and if you THINK.
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